Fountain City Flyers
March 2, 2015 at 9:50pm
Bag Tag 2015 Discussion
We are in the process of taking considerations of what worked and didn't work last year with the rules. I want the rules set and pretty much most everyone to understand and be comfortable with the rules prior to purchasing a tag to avoid hurt feelings and a season of whining and round dodging to hold on to the top tags. This is meant to be a fun way for folks to get out and play some disc golf OUTSIDE of leagues although tags add to the fun of the competitive spirit during leagues.
We have really considered making it so that on leagues you would be competing for tags against all those that owned tags regardless of what card you are on but it was brought to my attention that the person running leagues would have to enter the tag challenge into the scene to avoid people not knowing how everyone did and who all was there at leagues. Considering the task of adding scores into the scene for leagues is enough of a responsibility we want to avoid making it any more cumbersome than it already is keeping track of the ace pool and the scores. Knowing this it is your responsibility to understand that we make the league cards based on scores. It's our way of keeping the competition somewhat similar across the cards without having to have divisions. Every league director can do what they want but it has always been suggested that you split up cards evenly and no more than 4 players. Because the players on the top card tend to take longer lining up their shots and I usually choose to have less on the top card if there are 7 players for example to keep the pace of play moving. I'm not making that decision to jip you out of your chance at the top card that week it's just the way it is. In cases of ties for card position I use alphabetical order of the last name.
We have also decided that the top card from last year will be given tag number 1 free of charge unless they don't want to play this year. After that it's first come first serve basis.
It seemed like there was some attempts made to dodge challenges by scheduling rounds outside of Bryan in an attempt to avoid challenges or make it more difficult. If we want to look at making one of the 2 challenges mandatory in Bryan I am open to hearing ways to solve that. The not hearing from people for 2 weeks after a challenge thing seemed okay until you were supposed to relinquish your tag and upon doing so typically you'd be at the course and would decide to play each other anyways so I'm not sure how to make that better. It's an honor system, some have it others don't, I'm limited with what I can do with forcing someone to give me their tag. There was some finagling of the challenge rule where people would lose their tag and turn around and challenge them again for it immediately before they even had a chance to change the tag order on the scene. We could look at some stuff for that. Lets just keep in mind that this isn't Magic The Gathering and I don't need a 40 page rule book on this, it's a friendly competition and chances are you are going to have some good rounds and some bad rounds and the tags are going to change hands over and over again until the last couple weeks in October.
Here's the rules as they were last year:
2014 Bag Tag Challenge Rules:
1. Tags will be assigned on a first come first serve basis. You will be given the lowest numbered tag available at the time of purchase.
2. All tags must be carried to the challenge and displayed on your disc golf bag. If you don't have a bag you must at least have it with you.
3. A higher numbered tag can challenge a lower numbered tag. All challenges must be accepted, unless there are less than 2 weeks left in the season, or if there is already an outstanding challenge involving the challenged player. The lower numbered tag must select a location, format, and a tee set to play from as well as at least 2 times they can meet to play. Formats can include match play as well as stroke play. Times must be reasonable. If they cannot play in those 2 weeks they must trade their tag for the challengers. If the challenger cannot make either of the two offered times the challenge is void.
4. Ties will result in the original holder of the lowest bag tag winning the challenge and retaining their bag tag. Players may now optionally decide to play off extra holes in cases of ties. Ultimately it is up to the player who went into the round with the lower numbered tag to make that decision. Please be sure to check the tag updates after posting the scores to be sure that the tag numbers updated properly.
5. Consecutive round challenges DO NOT have to be accepted but can be if all parties agree.
6. Multiple people at the same course, playing at the same time and from the same tees can play for tags in groups of up to four people per group. You may play in groups of more than 4 but please use courtesy on the course. If there is a smaller group playing at a faster pace, you must let them play through. All tags are thrown into a pool and the person who wins takes the lowest numbered tag and second place takes 2nd lowest tag etc...
7. League and tournament rounds can be used for the Bag Tag Challenge if agreed to by the parties involved before the start of the round.
8. As the discgolfscene website is what we use to track the tag numbers owned by players we are requiring that each player be a member of the discgolfscene and post their scores within 24 hours of the round ending.
9. If a tag is lost the tag is dropped off the list and a new tag may be purchased at full price.
We should really look hard at allowing the tag challenges to be across whole events rather than only within cards. While I understand that it's one more thing to keep track of, the scores would be on record for league rounds, tournaments, and special events, so it shouldn't require a massive undertaking to distill the necessary information from them.
Another thing to consider is requiring tagholders to provide a phone number or email address that goes on a list given to the group to facilitate arranging challenge rounds. I don't have a way to get hold of everyone, and I will admit that I am sometimes very spotty in checking in here.
Yeah that's a good point Ben. The only thing I'm thinking of would be trying to figure out who would put them in and people who want to leave early from leagues and aren't sure where they fall. What tag do they take home or do they wait around?
It might be best to have it fall on whoever is running the event, if it's a club function. If a bunch of us go to some other thing and want to do a challenge there, it should be up to them to choose a person to do keep track of that.
By "them", I mean the group. My grammar is atrocious today.
I think the bag tag season started off a little bumpy last year, but finished pretty good all things considered.
I want to know when they will be available, let the challenging begin!
I think those are all good points. My goal is to have as many people participating in the tag challenge so
i want to make it fun for everyone. Being a realist I realize that not everyone is going to be happy. So far I like the idea of everyone playing for tags in league rounds regardless of what card you are on, but logistically trying to figure out what happens inevitably when someone forgets there tag ... more
i want to make it fun for everyone. Being a realist I realize that not everyone is going to be happy. So far I like the idea of everyone playing for tags in league rounds regardless of what card you are on, but logistically trying to figure out what happens inevitably when someone forgets there tag or needs to leave right after the round and one group is still 5 holes from being done. Also one person has offered to follow up the league rounds with entering the tag rounds after the league rounds have been recorded. That might fix the hassle of putting in the league rounds making us able to do that. I think generally most people just like playing and challenging people But I can say that because I've never been in contention for the number 1 tag. I really like the idea of knowing during a challenge round where my challenger is at stroke wise. It's difficult to stay competitive when you really have no clue what's happening on the other cards. I'm usually not on the fence on any issues but this one I am. I feel like we should really take it to vote. i know that causes some problems but in this case I think the more people behind a rule the more people enjoy it. As far as the match play I think we should just discontinue that. That would be way to hard to calculate and it turns into all luck when you have more than 2 people. I also think we should discontinue the option to play sudden death. For some reason I feel that when you enter scores as a tie the scene automatically defaults the tag numbers as the challenger taking the lower numbered card. Seems like there was a glitch or something with it because I had to fix a lot in cases of ties.
I did want to comment on the 2 week thing. Realistically the rule has no teeth because quite honestly I don't have a gang of meatheads ready to strip your tag from you when you don't answer to a challenge. I know that if you announce that you are going to be gone for a weekend or a week ... more
I did want to comment on the 2 week thing. Realistically the rule has no teeth because quite honestly I don't have a gang of meatheads ready to strip your tag from you when you don't answer to a challenge. I know that if you announce that you are going to be gone for a weekend or a week vacation people will challenge you and then just take your tag because there wasn't anyway you could play in that week so that's why there is 2 but Nick you are right there really isn't any reason why you couldn't get a round in in 1 week. The 2 weeks is for rare cases. I did see it used as a machanism to avoid challenges last year though. I'm not sure how to fix that. I really like playing on Friday nights for tags we could designate that as a round and people could put if they are coming or not on the scene so you could decide if you wanted to show up to better your tag. I just don't know if Fridays work for everyone else.
Plus once you have the top tag what would be the point to coming on Friday night if there's no reward for defending your title. We could make tag holders with some kind of markers like beads added to them so it would be a record of how many times you've defended that tag in a challenge. ... more
Plus once you have the top tag what would be the point to coming on Friday night if there's no reward for defending your title. We could make tag holders with some kind of markers like beads added to them so it would be a record of how many times you've defended that tag in a challenge. So a number 1 tag with 3 beads would mean you have defended the tag 3 times once you owned it. Kind of a bragging rights thing which is what it's about.
After reading the rules again, there is absolutely nothing in there expressly limiting tag challenges to only the players on a single card. The only limitation I find is more a suggestion to keep group sizes to four or fewer players to facilitate speed of play. Perhaps nothing needs to be changed in that regard, after all.
Yes, but it's also left open as to whether you want to play for tags. We need to make a decision as to whether you are forced to play for tags if you are at leagues or allowed to say. I'm having a bad day and not agreeing to playing for tags.
NICK, match play is also known as skins.
we've had people opt out of tags on a card before because they just weren't feeling it that day. no one had previously challenged them and it was no big deal that day. the only downside is if it becomes a chronic issue. if the same person keeps going it week after week. then we may have issues.
Nobody has to play for tags in a large group. I don't see why that would ever be an issue. If someone gets a tag and absolutely refuses to play for tags at all, I can see how that would be annoying, but I don't imagine that a person who would pull that would get a tag in the first place. ... more
Nobody has to play for tags in a large group. I don't see why that would ever be an issue. If someone gets a tag and absolutely refuses to play for tags at all, I can see how that would be annoying, but I don't imagine that a person who would pull that would get a tag in the first place. Also, at that point, they can keep the dumb thing if it's that precious to them, IMO. At the end of the day, there is no prize money, trophy, or even a cookie attached to holding a certain tag at the end of the year so they are ultimately mcguffins anyway.
I would never support forcing anyone to do anything they didn't want to do, other than putting the gun down and letting the girl go. Playing for tags should be optional, always.
^ Depends on the girl. lol
:-)
Hahaha. So should we get tags with Sesame Street characters on them instead of numbers?
I call Oscar!
I'm not comfortable with Elmo.
What I'm hearing is the big issue on the table is whether we allow play across the whole league or card to card. The rest of it all seems like it's how people decide to play and no rule is really going to force anyone to play at leagues if they don't want to. I can see people saying ... more
What I'm hearing is the big issue on the table is whether we allow play across the whole league or card to card. The rest of it all seems like it's how people decide to play and no rule is really going to force anyone to play at leagues if they don't want to. I can see people saying Yeah I'll throw down on my card but not over the whole league and at that point it would become an absolute nightmare trying to figure out who was challenging across the league and who wasn't and who would take the tag from that card and wouldn't get it across the league. I say a decision must be made to force everyone who has a tag to play for it or it or if we decide to only do card to card then they can decide before the match whether they are playing for it or not.
No, if someone from the card opts into the pool for the day, they are not eligible for and other tags on that card. If no one on the card opts into the pool, then everyone on the card can take part in on the same card tag challenges.
there is no playing for tags in the pool and on the side, its one or the other. easy as that
Another option is that whoever wants to play for tags is reserved for the top card. Top 4 numbered cards that show up and want to play for them at leagues play on teh top card regardless of position. If you want to play on the top card buy a tag or start playing for it.
and before the league round starts, write down all the people who are in the league pool.
Now that I think about it that would solve a lot of the problems. No question as to how to make the top card. People that want to play with the top guys are going to have to put their card up to do it and if you're not feeling it that day you can play on a lower pressure card and not the top one.
I think Nick actually suggested this option in a previous post and if I had to vote I'd vote for this one.
I'm working on a proposal. I'll have something later today.
Well if the goal is to have a toeline then no. If the goal is to mow over them wihtout having to worry about 2x4's hitting a blade than yes
I like the idea for the holes that are out in the midlde of the grass like 11, 12 and 13. It would look weird on holes 3 and whites from 6 and 7.
They'd get stolen everyday.
Vandalism is going to occur out there either way. Bricks would be easier to replace. I also don't understand why the price at this low of a cost is going to be an issue. How many fences has the soccer squad paid for and we're haggling over $12 per pad. I'd personally like it if so ... more
Vandalism is going to occur out there either way. Bricks would be easier to replace. I also don't understand why the price at this low of a cost is going to be an issue. How many fences has the soccer squad paid for and we're haggling over $12 per pad. I'd personally like it if some of the taxes I pay go towards discgolf instead of a fenced in area for people to run their dogs in the winter time.
To get back on topic, here’s my proposal: 1 Have a discgolfscene.com account. 2. Buy a tag. 3. If you want to participate in a tag round, you need to have your tag with you. 4. Tag rounds may consist of any number of players playing at the same course at the same time under the s ... more
To get back on topic, here’s my proposal: 1 Have a discgolfscene.com account. 2. Buy a tag. 3. If you want to participate in a tag round, you need to have your tag with you. 4. Tag rounds may consist of any number of players playing at the same course at the same time under the same rules. 5. Lowest score for round gets lowest numbered tag up for grabs in that round. Second lowest gets second lowest tag. Proceed ad infinitum. Ties can be decided by playoff if tied players care to do it that way. If not, lower number going in is lower number coming out.
I'd like to note that we're putting far too much thought into this already.
So what happens when 6 people on cards 1 and 2 at leagues want to play for tags and a guy on the top card only wants to play the other 3 people on his card biut not the people on card 2 and a guy with his tag on card 2 doesn't want to play for tags at all against anyone and inevitably the guy with the number 2 tag forgot his tag at home.
This scenario seems pretty reasonable considering you are not forcing anyone to play for tags. It's possible but logistically you would need a seperate staff person to keep track of who gets what at the end and entering it all in.
If the player who only wants to challenge within the card can talk the others on the card into it, more power to them. The player who does not want to play for tags at all is not required to put their tag up for grabs, and may still participate with the others. The totality of the rules governing ... more
If the player who only wants to challenge within the card can talk the others on the card into it, more power to them. The player who does not want to play for tags at all is not required to put their tag up for grabs, and may still participate with the others. The totality of the rules governing bag tags in Fort Wayne is "have fun, and accept challenges", and they make it work. I'd like to see something not too much more complicated than that, as nobody should be putting serious stock in what their tag number means or says about them as a person or player.
Power goes to the majority.
I thought in Fort Wayne they forced you to play for tags if you showed up to leagues with a tag. My problem isn't about trying tom limit peoples fun it's me trying to put all this **** in the computer when tags 1,2,3 and 4 agree to play for tags amongst themselves and the guy with the 6th ... more
I thought in Fort Wayne they forced you to play for tags if you showed up to leagues with a tag. My problem isn't about trying tom limit peoples fun it's me trying to put all this **** in the computer when tags 1,2,3 and 4 agree to play for tags amongst themselves and the guy with the 6th tag has an outstanding challenge against tag number 2 going on the second week but can't get on the top card to challenge them tag number 3 wants to play only people on his card and tags 1,2,4,5, and 6 want to play across the league. To top ita ll off I'm scrambling around trying to write all this down and then also who brought money and who forgot their dollar at home for the ace pool..
1,2,4,5, and 6 plays for tags. #3 does not put his tag up because he doesn't want to go with the majority. Plus if number 6 is waiting to play #2 but two plays 1-4 first, #6 will still be playing for a lower tag
Ok I can follow that. You either play for tags in leagues or you don't and it's all or nothing across the league you aren't allowed to pick and choose who you play in the league. 2 week rule still apples and if you can't come to leagues and put it up within that 2 week period y ... more
Ok I can follow that. You either play for tags in leagues or you don't and it's all or nothing across the league you aren't allowed to pick and choose who you play in the league. 2 week rule still apples and if you can't come to leagues and put it up within that 2 week period you are supposed to give it to the other player who challenged you. If you don't I get to send Ben to your house to snap your legs off at the crotch.
1 of the two challenges has to be in Bryan. Lower tag still gets to pick course and tees. No match play anymore. You must submit a way to contact you to a master list that will be displayed to others in the tag challenge and you are responsible for checking that method regularly or I'm sending Ben after you.
I think we are almost ready to make an order. I've never sold over 20 so I figure that is the amount I will order. If we need more I will see about ordering more later.
I would just do it as tags at league are up to the majority of those in attendance as to whether to play a tag pool or per card basis.
And why no more match play?
Also, anyone caught taking the thing seriously will be flogged.
^ agreed
No match play because no one ever does it and with more than 2 people in the round it could go on forever.
First draft. I condensed the rules down to only 7. Check the wording on 5, I'm not sure if I left a loophole in it. I tried to make it so if there were people that had an outstanding challenge and wanted to complete it during the league round but didn't want to compete against everyone else in the event wide challenge than they could do that.
Is there a way to see what you have so far?
Perhaps a Google doc link or something.
No
It won't copy and paste
2015 Bag Tag Challenge Rules: 2015 Bag Tag Challenge Rules: 1. Tags will be assigned on a first come first serve basis. You will be given the lowest numbered tag available at the time of purchase. First place tag from last year will receive first rights to the #1 tag this year and will not be requi ... more
2015 Bag Tag Challenge Rules: 2015 Bag Tag Challenge Rules: 1. Tags will be assigned on a first come first serve basis. You will be given the lowest numbered tag available at the time of purchase. First place tag from last year will receive first rights to the #1 tag this year and will not be required to purchase the tag.2. All tags must be carried to the challenge and displayed on your disc golf bag. If you don't have a bag you must at least have it with you.3. A higher numbered tag can challenge a lower numbered tag. All challenges must be accepted, unless there are less than 2 weeks left in the season, or if there is already an outstanding challenge involving the challenged player. The lower numbered tag must select a location, format, and a tee set to play from as well as at least 2 times they can meet to play. One of the 2 locations must be in Bryan. Times must be reasonable. If they cannot play in those 2 weeks they must trade their tag for the challengers. If the challenger cannot make either of the two offered times the challenge is void.4. Ties will result in the original holder of the lowest bag tag winning the challenge and retaining their bag tag. Players may decide to play off extra holes in cases of ties. Ultimately it is up to the player who went into the round with the lower numbered tag to make that decision. Please be sure to check the tag updates after posting the scores to be sure that the tag numbers updated properly.5. Multiple people at the same course, playing at the same time and from the same tees can play for tags in groups of up to four people per group on one card, or during leagues or other events people may decide to play across the entire event or league. It is up to the player to decide whether they want to be included in the “event wide†challenge or if they would like to exclude themselves. Players may choose to exclude themselves from the “event wide†challenge and challenge others that are not in the “event wide†challenge. You may play in groups of more than 4 but please use courtesy on the course. If there is a smaller group playing at a faster pace, you must let them play through. All tags are thrown into a pool and the person who wins takes the lowest numbered tag and second place takes 2nd lowest tag etc...6. As the discgolfscene website is what we use to track the tag numbers owned by players we are requiring that each player be a member of the discgolfscene and post their scores within 24 hours of the round ending. All players are required to have a phone number or email address to answer to challenges and will be responsible for checking the email or phone number they submitted for challenges.7. If a tag is lost the tag is dropped off the list and a new tag may be purchased at full price.
Apparently it doesn't like spaces
Try this. I have it in Google Docs with suggestions. It seemed a bit wordy. https://docs.google.com/document/d/1KelldDvZkAXJD9MunrGgAINSIenW0UBYwhrJ6g7tJDI/edit?usp=sharing